On today’s episode Ariana, Ikram and Vikki talk about action, what to do and where to go next. Learn how you can donate to the Black Lives Matter movement, how you can volunteer to help suffering families and use your skills to help people at protests and more. The girls also discuss learning to take care of yourself and also discuss police brutality and military de-escalation! Strap yourself in for another powerful and touching episode of k, thanks.
On today’s episode Ariana, Ikram and Vikki talk about action, what to do and where to go next. Learn how you can donate to the Black Lives Matter movement, how you can volunteer to help suffering families and use your skills to help people at protests and more. The girls also discuss learning to take care of yourself and also discuss police brutality and military de-escalation! Strap yourself in for another powerful and touching episode of k, thanks.
Timestamps:
00:00 - 1:40 - Introduction
1:40 - 8:33 - Building your support ecosystem
8:33 - 17:00 - Healing justice events
17:00 - 30:00 Volunteering your time to help the BLM movement
30:00 - 30:50 - It’s essential to remember to take care of yourself
31:00 - 45:47 - Discussing police brutality and how we de-escalated situations in the military
45:57 - 52:03 What is JRTC and how would it help the police?
52:03 - Wrap-up and outros
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Thanks for tuning in indicate things, a podcast for the modern woman every week, your host eager Vicki and Ariana will dig in on real topics that matter in the new age, stay locked in. You won't want to miss anything. Welcome to K thanks podcast. This is our fourth episode. This is the podcast for the modern woman where we speak our heart and we speak our mind about different topics that affect us in the modern age. I'm your host Vikki and these are my cohost, Ikram and Ariana. Today. We're going to focus on taking actions and now you're at a really good point in your healing stage. Now you want to do something about it. So that's what we're going to talk about. Many are asking what they can do. They don't know where to start. We're here to give you some inspirational tips and encourage you to seek out some opportunities within your community. So, yeah, let's go ahead and tackle that.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes. The biggest thing here, we're trying to form some sort of plan, right? Like an action plan for you that is specific to you. You don't have to do what everyone is doing. You can go down a list of a long list of things you can potentially do to support black lives matter. In this case, in this today's topic, specifically as ensured that it is not another hashtag. And so like in that, and then we can, we can discuss like ways to go about reform resources, resources, legit organizations out there, you know, if you want to donate who to donate to and so on. So let's dive right in, you know, and this is, this is a straight up from an online source that we will share down below. It's called 26 ways to meet in this struggle beyond the streets, right? One of the number one thing would be host or attend, know your rights training.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
I can not tell you the importance of that lady is pleased like pitch. And so no, you're right. You can go to justice committee, their org. There is a number of additional online websites include Malcolm Max's, grassroot movements, Amex, gm.org, streetwise and safe.org. A lot of universities are teaching this literally the other day I was in a protest and people were heading out like a lawyer was handing out their personal number. You know, if you get in legal trouble, like call me, but it is important. Can any of you touch on like a personal experience? If you have any, I know
Speaker 1 (02:38):
That I used to do this. I'm probably going to start doing it again. I used to carry around a little kind of like a pocket booklet with my rights on it, just so I had it kind of readily available for me. I noticed a lot of other people that do that too. I liked that. That was kind of like a old school, you know, how they have like these trends. And I know like I was doing it way back in the day, but something tells me I should bring that back. And then also like encourage others to do that too. Just having a handy because it's, it's a lot to try to memorize. So it's good to have something kind of, you could slip in your pocket book or slip in your wallet or something like that. You already are kind of ready and know,
Speaker 2 (03:20):
I like that because like a lot of times when you're in the heat of the moment and you're being targeted, or you kind of like do blackout, you know, you do like your emotions overwhelm you. You can't think clearly. And I feel like having that little card is super useful. Again, like a lot of this the resources we're going to be covering are based on educational, like, you know, foundation. So you can literally do online courses. However you want to, you can host or attend, know your rights training. Another thing you can do is fundraisers. You can donate business proceeds, create events, organize organizations that work around on police violence on police, accountability against the criminalization of the black community. And so that includes black lives matter. Ferguson action can reach them@fergusonaction.com, Ferguson national response network, black youth project, a long list of, again, that we'll be sharing in the comments.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
I just want to emphasize that it's super, super important to research your organizations before donating to them. A lot of these larger organizations have been unfortunately infiltrated, but it's definitely a lot more effective to donate to your local organizations that are more grassroots focused and focused on the issues that are directly affecting your community. So yeah, we definitely need to hit at home. It's it's important that you don't just kind of copy what we say and actually take the time to do your own research. That's we're just giving you, we're just trying to spark and inspire you to go and seek out information for yourself. But at the end of the day, you should always, always, always research. And I'm looking to everything. I don't care if it's someone that you idolize telling you to do it, you need to go look into it for yourself. So hopefully that's something that people can start doing
Speaker 2 (05:23):
And please spread the word, like share with us. That's another means of supporting this movement and taking action spreading yes, communications spreading the word actions, events demands through social media texts, emails, like the list goes on, right? Bringing awareness and awareness and share and spreading awareness offer to be an emergency contact. You know, and again, this kind of everything we've talked about, right? Everything we've talked about is building your support ecosystem and moving as a community. So please like, you know, you don't necessarily have to ask someone to be your emerging economy, but instead offer it offer to be one. Ah, yes, leaning
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Three. My emergency contacts now were always your emergency contact. I love that.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Be active in your community, attend planning, meetings, strategy calls. You know, these are happen on a local level with politicians, you know, with your city supervisors, with the commission boards that you know, are appointed by the mayor. And this goes like anywhere from like super local to like national level be involved. You know, most of these things, if not all are hosted publicly, right?
Speaker 3 (06:54):
Yeah. Like on like C-SPAN and things like that. Yeah. I think like the more you guys get to know me, the more you'll see how anti-system I am. But honestly, I watched this guy in SAC. I think it was either yesterday or the day before Sacramento just shut shit down. And I think like just how he was able to like really capture and no one watches C-SPAN like, you can't like, you're a liar. If you tell me that you sit at home, I got back in that day, my mom I'm like, nobody knows thoughts, go across the bottom or something like that. Like, there's this video of like CSPAN trending right now because this guy in Sacramento made such a big deal. I think that's really fucking high.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
Right. I think, yes, you have a voice and they have to sit there and hear it. Right. And you can not one statement that I love and this applies to anything I do. Like whether it's business or personal life, you don't get what you don't ask for. Right.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
Right. And it's true
Speaker 2 (07:57):
If you think about it, you know, like I get it. Like the system is pretty fucked up and I'm not taking away from that. But a lot of times, you know, it's amazing what we can do by simply asking right. Or changing one's opinion or something like that. So in the attending planning meetings or strategy calls, there are few ones that are specific to black lives matter, critical resistance. It's a national one. You can go to critical resistance.org or insight bash national.org. Right. And you'll find more resources on that support or organize. This touches my heart. So for our organized healing, justice events,
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Beautiful any more about that.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
So essentially Adrian Marie Brown, Utah, and Leah, they and Susan have created a list of healing practices to sustain care in protests. And we will definitely have a Bitly to it. It's T it is bit that Lee slash 13, Doug X capital a we'll definitely have that below. It is, it is. We've talked with, we touched on this actually creating space to facilitate these practices with others, process it in a community. I know the thing, Oh, this, this hits home cook a pre or post March meal. Those sweet, very sweet personal experience. So I went on the recent protest that was on Wednesday. It was hosted by my high school mission, high school proud bears. And this high school, like it's in the center of San Francisco in the mission, like right across from Dolores park. And it has so much history, so much history. And it's speaking of it, you know, they've always been on the right side of history and it comes to like advocating for minorities and speaking up and holding officials accountable. One of my favorite parts, like super gangster, like most of the teachers there have been in jail as activists
Speaker 1 (10:05):
They've been jailed. You don't hear that.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
No, I know. And it's just, I have chills talking about this. Like I'm so proud of that school. So I show up thinking that this is going to be like a hundred, 200, you know, people. And it turned out 50,000 people. That's huge. And most beautiful thing was they had like water snacks Gatorades, and these were not for sale. They were for free right now is extremely important. And it's, this is how you know, you're in San Francisco and I will admit it I'll be the first one that we are super privileged, super fortunate. They were handing out like Hawaii or the, and some of you might say like it was sparkling water,
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Silicon Valley, like little cool. I'm showing up at protests now. Oh my God, let me tell you guys last pride I went to in San Francisco, they had this guy performing Anala. It wasn't a LaCroix was cracking up. It was like, I was like, Oh my God type community. I swear to God. It's like an every bike or kitchen everywhere. It was so interesting. I did want to mention, like in our last episode thing was the last one where we mentioned meetup.com.com is also a great resource for finding I'm meetings with them. Like any type of activism, political or social justice meetups near you. It's another good thing for that. Or you can create, if you say, you know, you have a different point of view, you can create your own organization on there as well. So that's another good resource to find like minds or create your own thing.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yes. And to take it up a notch, you can totally coordinate or provide childcare. Oh wait. Yes. It's totally doable. I know that babies are protests. I said, I've seen some babies. I've seen some feisty ones too. That they're like black lives matter. You know? Like what was her name? Winter, winter. She was in LA. I dunno. She was in LA. I don't know where she was.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
I seen, I think I saw it like turning or something. She was she, did she have like her hair braided or I don't remember. I think I,
Speaker 2 (12:24):
While you look it up, we can talk about like similar experiences. I saw this video of this, this little feisty girl. You though. She's like, I just, you know, I'm out here walking for unity. I want the whole world to be, you know, this one unit. She's like, nah, I know this, the intent of this is not just racism. And she just went on. She had to be like five years old. I see. I feel like,
Speaker 1 (12:51):
I honestly feel like the children are the future. I feel like a lot of us just step out of the way and let a lot of our youth, not a feeling. It's a
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Fact
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Youth take the lead. I was, I was in a, like a group like yesterday that was trying to do activism in my community. And I just noticed like, from a lot of the older crowd, like they were really trying to like silence their voices. And, and in my mind, I'm like,
Speaker 2 (13:20):
We've had plenty of time. We've had prey
Speaker 1 (13:25):
And they are not coming with there. They are, a lot of them are very rational thinking because they've had information for so long. I think for us has given them kind of like a little bit. Cause we have the experience right there. They just have the knowledge on some of these things. We can come in on experience point of view, but I really think like letting them take the lead, you know, especially some of these
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Middle school, high school college,
Speaker 1 (13:50):
Like let them organize it. Why, why do we silence their voices? And that goes back to what we were talking about. Like, I think the other day about like growing up with that mentality of like children be quiet, like, Oh, sit over there. Like this is the adult conversation. I think a lot of the older generation still have that mentality. And a lot of us grew up in that and we seen how harmful it was and like silencing our voices. So I think it's so important if you have youth out there, there's so many of them out there that want to do good. They want to change the world. They never understood why we let this happen for so long. And they really have the passion in their heart to want to change it. They just need some of them just need a little guidance on like just, you know, certain things to be a little bit more diplomatic about certain things to get things done. Right. But they have like some of the great greatest ideas I just was like, wow, you guys are so just having like conversations, like with my own kids, I'm just like, how old are you?
Speaker 2 (14:50):
They're really,
Speaker 1 (14:52):
They're really beyond their age. Like they carry so much with them, with them. Like one thing like the little girl's name is I feel weird calling her a little girl. The young woman's name is winter more Rogers. My heart is with you. I love you so much. Like you can see like there's so many comments. Like you could see the strength of her ancestors in her eyes. Like, Oh no, no fear. Like there is like pure, like fierce like power, just like
Speaker 2 (15:22):
I'm sure to include, you know, like include her in the description so that people can actually,
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Yeah, it'd be amazing.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
The, this last protest, like most protests are organized here in San Francisco are actually organized by high school students that successful 50,000 people who marched together successfully and peacefully, you know? And again, like that's another thing that media does, you know, like just based this fear tactics, you know, these people, we were marching to the beats of the drum. We had like native Americans exercising, like native American, like rituals. We had Mexicans doing the same thing. It was just so beautiful. And we had like student body of like drummers, you know, that were performing. And they, they, the little bit of like some Brazilian name, same as though it was just so lovely, right. To come together in such a positive way to knock on the door for change. Right. And actually
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Have you guys seen, Oh yeah, go ahead. Have you guys seen the video of, I think it's two different protests where there's a group of people performing Namaz, which is like the Muslim prayer that we do five times a day, they're out in the middle of a protest and there's like, yeah. And there's a ring around them as they perform normally.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
Yeah. People will like the non-Muslims depths to the random to protect them. And so they did like the, the prayer that was specific, you know, like for a black lives matter.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
It was so beautiful. So incredible. I think another thing that I wanted to mention about taking action to that, I think a lot of us, I haven't seen mentioned a lot out there, but also like volunteering your time. Like depending on like what part of the movement is inspiring to you, you can also give your time. So if you are concerned about like the homeless population, you can go volunteer at a shelter. Like if you want to help fight like education, like inequality or that you can volunteer in an inner city school. So there's so many other ways too, that you can fight and make an impact besides like marching, you know, because not everybody's into all those things. Right. So they're trying to find other ways. And I think that's a great, great way just to identify the cause that you support and then find opportunities where you can donate your time to, you know, helping make things better for, for those communities
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Bottles for the homeless. Yes, absolutely. You know, create and share arts, have beautiful stack, you know, kind of creating and sharing are, it's such a beautiful way to like process trauma and, you know, elevate yourself into like these high vibes of just positivity. You can also create a home base, you know, for any evening. And again, like some of these are related to protests, but like in many ways, these forms can also be applied in a general manner for support, right. Creating a home base like that one in LA, I believe where the heat, this guy was actually stopped by the police. He was entering his home, I'll link the video, he was entering his home. He was frisked by the police. And then he's like, that's my home right there. And he happened to be Indian. So he went in and all over the media, you see the newest talking about like how these protesters looted, this guy's home.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
But he actually opened the door for them to actually shelter in the home with him and to protect the protesters that were being attacked. I was so such a beautiful, like moment of unity and like this, this man, which I'll, we'll find the video and make sure we link it as well, because we want everybody to see all these things for what they are not just based off like what we're telling you, your perception of it could absolutely be so different from mine. And that is okay. Right. And if we're missing the point here, please share it with us. Tell us in the comments, you know? Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
They were very humble people I ever met that I have a question for you. So for people that want to get involved with like meeting their politicians, right. When they're talking about like sending letters and emails and talking about how to like articulate an issue and without it coming across as like emotional language, what are some of kind of the ways that people can connect to their local politics?
Speaker 2 (19:55):
There are so many ways. One of the biggest one is definitely finding out when your local supervisors. So like each city has like all these elected officials and each district within the city has their own supervisor. Right? You have the right to actually approach your district supervisor or anyone for that matter reach out to their offices, get your opinion on certain things and obviously strength in numbers. So the more the merrier, if it touches on the same topic, then they must address it as well. Right? Like, and again, like you don't get what you don't ask for. If they are not aware of a certain thing, then let them be aware, informed them. If you see something that is wrong, you're absolutely right. To bring it up and back it up with like facts and whatever, all that you, you can prove your point. Absolutely. If you want change, you are it okay. Do not wait for anyone else to change it for you. You have the tools, you have the power to stand up and be the change yourself. Okay. Right, right. And I want you, if anything of, none of these stick, just remember you, are it, you are the change. You want something changed, get up, start moving forward. Step-By-Step and get it done.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Yes. And it's, it's important to meet these people where they are. So you don't want to reach out to them. Like very, I know some of these issues are very emotional to our listeners, but you just want to think critically. And you also want to make sure that you're presenting factual information to them and you're coming from that kind of place. Right. Cause you don't want things to be misconstrued in your message there. So I know a lot of people are like anger. They're like, nah, I want it. But that's, you have to kind of be a little diplomatic in a way when you're approaching these people, just because that's the only language they really understand. So it's kind of hard to find that you're not, you know, not writing them in the heat of the moment when you're so angry and mad or not call it a lot of people call and leave messages.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
And you just got to remember the same thing. You don't want the message to get lost in your emotions because you feel some kind of way about it. So you just got to take some time to calm yourself down. Maybe write down some notes, some data points and looking up some research on our last episode about dealing, right? You don't want to have, you want to come from a place of strength, but also humility. You don't want to have kind of a T you know, you don't want to have like a, it's a demand, but it's not a forceful demand. It's just like here, this is why, this is what the issue that I'm standing on. This is why I'm standing on it. There are some, you know, action items that I, I feel like I need to see, you know, in order for that to change and then you hold them accountable for it.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
And then you go to the polls. So another thing Ingram, I had a question why I'm asking so many questions. I just Achram is our diplomatic person. She knows about politics. So I have a question I'm talking about like voting and go into the polls. So a lot of people I've noticed they don't really vote for in their local elections. They also, a lot of them don't vote in their like community elections. A lot of people just vote for like the presidential election or like the, you know, the main ones that happen every four years. And instead of really researching the lowest levels of government and how those affect you. Cause I feel like you can have more of an impact there obviously like then the bigger stage at sometimes I think those people,
Speaker 2 (23:29):
I think on a local level, from a local perspective, your, your elected officials are the ones to actually speak up for you in these larger, you know, national or statewide political events and so on right policy. It starts from, you know, your local representatives. So it is extremely important. I urge everyone who, who feels, you know, this, this need this sense of, you know getting together as a community and supporting black lives matter. I urge you to vote locally and nationally. That is essentially we're built on this where we actually have the ability to vote for people who we want.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
You didn't vote for somebody. I can only say that so much. Cause I, I know that's happening right now, vote for vote.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
And I know that it's extremely difficult in the days that we're in today. And you might see like different news, different topics, different ways of pushing the same agenda or different genders, like on several platforms. I urge you to do your research. You know, just always dig just if you were just on the surface, just scratch a lot of it. You know, you don't have to be like a, you know, a PhD holder to do like some deep research. You have the power to do this. And back to like some of ways I believe in you other ways, right? You can offer to create like a safety plan. You can create an intentional spiritual space and all these resources we've spoken previously about. You can be a grounding buddy. You can be as self care, buddy. You guys are not so many jobs. When I get through with now, you said I can be a grounding buddy. And you also said, you can be my emergency contact guide away. You also said, you're going to cook for me,
Speaker 1 (25:39):
Everything for you, honey,
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Ride to the grocery store.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Oh my God. Just be a support. That's almost support system. Cause it's something about having that and, and you might not even have had that in your life, right? Maybe you grew up in, you didn't really have you. Weren't surrounded by supportive voices, especially for people that are in communities and communities that are kind of spreading hate where even the young people, you know, even people that are kind of have the small voices and they're just like, Oh my God, I really like, I feel like I just want to get out.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
Hmm.
Speaker 1 (26:16):
Just know there's people out there that are in that same situation, you should find those people and band together and creates something because those people need that space too. And they're looking for that. So maybe, you know, you could start something. I think like the key here is if you don't see it, start it. If you don't see it in your community, you make it happen. There's so many tools out there. We literally are so lucky to have so much technology and information. We can literally
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Build it ourself, not in place. So yeah. Support systems are important. Work with your local work with your local teachers.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
Yeah. That's that right? There is so important. Like we have so much knowledge to share and spread around and like just creating a course, like even on knowing your rights or how to, I don't know the proper term, but how to like diffuse.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
Or, or yeah. Or, you know, escalate like a very,
Speaker 2 (27:18):
He didn't tense
Speaker 3 (27:20):
Form first aid at a protest, you know, like, you know, how to, how to guide people in a protest, you know?
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Yeah. The protest I was in, I actually, I carried my backpack, my military backpack. That is my assault. Right. So I was a, I was the CLS you know, we're all trained on combat lifesaving and we operate just fine under, you know, to rest and stress. And, and so my brother wanted to go, I supported him and I was like, well, no, I can definitely, you know, like, cause you see so many conflicting news, you know, and like how things can escalate so quickly. Fortunately, none of that happened, but I was ready. I had my like first aid bag and I was ready to diffuse the escalate, any scenario. And it's important too, to have people like us in these situations right here, inciting and you know, fight it violence and so on. We're here to support and ensure that our people, our communities safe and when there is a need for that, we step in and we make it how we take care of them.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
And that's why I was there. You know, I was there to voice my opinion, black lives matter. And most importantly, if there were to be a situation, I was there to step forward and you know, sharing skills, mobile concept of train the trainer, he can space to process having these conversations, start the conversation, let the conversation go. Right. Like get it going, support people with disabilities. Okay. You know? And, and I get it. So like right now, like the focus is on black lives matter. It's not to take away from like everyone else. We understand, we understand that most lives do matter, you know? Like, but right now, like the analogy of like that house on fire. So yeah. Can you tell us about it?
Speaker 3 (29:18):
Yeah. So basically it's this image of like a house on fire in a house next to it and that's not on fire and the figure and the images like my house is on fire. And I think it's something like to the effect of, well, all houses matter. It's like, it's not the point. My house is on fire now. Right.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
I think it was interesting. I think I saw another illustration where like the firefighter was actually hosing down the house that was not on fire. You know what I mean? And it's blitz, right? So it's a, we're all like all hands on deck right now to support, you know, the black community black lives matter. Let's move forward as a community lessons learned from this, let's take actions. Let's, let's ask for reforms and let's ask for changes of policy and so on. And so that we can apply it in so many other ways. I think before we touch on like another topic, I want your opinions on this. It is essential to remember, to take care of yourself first, if you can't do any of the above, if you're short on time or resources, please start with taking care of yourself. And we've shared so many resources previously and again, working on your support ecosystem. And that's what we're here for to build that support ecosystem, to be here for you and you be there for us. Absolutely. You need to be able to fill your cup so that you can pour into others. You can't pour from an ongoing. So this is going to take a one 80 shifts here, being these gorgeous ladies, my cohosts, these army veterans, these combat army veterans. Woo.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
So I want to share a little bit of our insights into military deescalation of force, rules of engagement, and also as sense as a sensitive topic, I get it, but police brutality, I'm not talking about police in general, I'm talking police brutality and excessive use of force. I want to open up the floor to have these discussions and talk about our military experience and also like how our police is, is militarized in so many ways. Go ahead. Talk to me. Usually I'm not a loss for words, I guess I wasn't prepared for that. I know I can get it going. And then the chain, you know, I think it's fine. I think a good start point, a good starting point is we overseas, we're not, are not allowed to use any type of force, you know, let alone, you know, brutality unless we're engaged, right? That's the key point, right? For example, for example, in our fight against terrorism, a terrorist, and I'm not defining anything, I'm not saying a specific region or anything. This is extremely general. So if someone is, is holds a gun, I still can't shoot them. I still cannot engage or protect or none of that. They have to shoot at me first in
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Order for us to actually conduct a rules of engagement, right.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Rules of engagement. I actually let me look it up real quick. I used to have that shame, memory,
Speaker 1 (32:50):
Hand rules. I, I have something that I can add as far as like my thoughts on deescalation, just because I've worked for a couple of different agencies. So I've military and corrections cause in corrections, like we don't have any weapons. So a lot of it is all about psychological, like deescalation, just using your words and your body language. So just also keeping in mind like your body language, when you are trying to deescalate a situation, cause there's certain ways that you can pose your body in a way that seems threatening to a person, but you got to keep in mind, like people have had a number of different experiences in traumas. So like certain things can trigger certain reactions. So it's very smart to come from like a neutral space. So you should be able to at least kind of deescalate yourself in your mind to before you even react, be the person that has the calm and the cool head, even when, if someone's like freaking out.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
Right. So, and then just like basically just slowing down, like, you know, backing off a little bit, every single interaction doesn't need to require immediate action. And I've told some people this, you know, when stopped by the cops, it's like, okay, even if you didn't do anything right. You know, you didn't do anything, but there's certain types of behaviors that will trigger certain types of behaviors. Right. so just like keeping your body open, not like, you know, just being very neutral and also not taking a head on stance. So a lot of people get threatened by a head on stance. So that can be perceived as a threat to kind of tilting your body a little bit to the side is a good way to not look so aggressive as well. That's another way that you can deescalate maybe if they're escalating things. And then I'm also just being like, everything just goes back to empathy, just being compassionate.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
Okay. We don't know what type of day that person had. What just happened to them with her going through, you know, on a police officers. So they could be coming from like a crazy like situation and from a, the other person's side, they could be coming from a crazy situation too. Right. And so a lot of times we react so fast and because we're so emotional, but like what's worked for me. I'm also someone that could react really fast. It's just taking the time to take a breath and go internal. Maybe that's five seconds. Maybe that's 10 in your head to just kind of relax, right. Because you have to, no matter, no matter what's going on, you just need to take a moment rather than having that immediate reaction and just have a little bit of compassion. And then just using a little bit of discretion, also taking notes. So this, if it's an officer and he's acting a little, little, like crazy, you don't have to talk. So that's another one of your rights. You don't have to
Speaker 3 (35:38):
Say anything either. You can, you can use that. Right. And you can just literally just
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Listen. No.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
And what they have to say, you calm yourself down. Doesn't matter. Cause they might say something inflammatory, but in your mind you need to be keeping yourself calm. Right.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
I hope I, I couldn't agree more. I think that there is a lack of this type of training in our police force. Right. I get it. You know, like initially how it's, how it's built on this like false, terrible injust system. That's a, that's a way there's there ways we can like dissect that and go at it from a political perspective and urge our local and national officials and representatives to actually work on these things and address it from that level from a policy level. But also there is a whole aspect and the aspect that is not necessarily talk about a whole lot and that is training the forest, right? How do we train them? I think on average it takes what like six months to be a police officer, you know when you're out there and they focus heavily on reaction, you know, like fast reaction that they're, it's almost like they're encouraged to actually react before assessing the scenario where as even in the military, in a war zone, we are the quite the opposite. And so I always found out fi found that to be kind of like contradicting of conflict to me, it's like what, you know, it should be quite the opposite. In my opinion,
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Are you saying something that our command like B into our heads was just hearts and minds? You know what I'm like? That was, that was the priority was hearts and minds. And it's more important to understand where they're coming from and understand their situation. And although yes, like we're, we're still, you know, very vigilant, but it's, it's very important to understand who we're dealing with. You know what I mean? And I think that would change the narrative completely, but just to return to safety during protests and moving more tactically, tactically, I mentioned vigilance. And I think that that could be the difference between a peaceful and a peaceful protest and a violent like riot. I think that if you are vigilant and you are, you know, always looking at your surroundings, you're noticing things, you're seeing people act strange. You see people who are outsiders, you know, like doing things that are not in line with what everyone else is doing and you do something about it. You bring awareness to that. That's empathy. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
And, and that's why, like, I feel the sense of responsibility on kind of like maybe pushing the agenda on, on supporting this retraining and you know, like what a better way to get, you know, veterans, military trained to actually show them the ropes on like deescalation of force and the power of that, you know? And not only is it powerful, it's extremely empowering as well. You know, it's very rewarding. I think that in the heat of the moment, one can lose, you know, like the sense of a sense of guidance, you know, like most people actually blackout when they reach a level of adrenaline in their system. Right. And you don't remember. So I think it was beat into us like that whole like muscle memory. And I was like, what your brain goes through this process of like, do this, do this, do this, do this, you know, and then like last resort, but here at home and in the streets of the United States, there's absolutely no need to go to those extreme measures.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
Right. It is unfortunate, you know, the bad guy exists everywhere, but it is not the majority. So there's definitely a call for retraining, the force, learning a whole new sets of rules, rules of engagement, you know, doing simulations and continuing, I don't even know. They don't necessarily go through, you know, like quarterly training or mandated, you know, training and so on to like maintain and keep up, you know, they, they, you know, they say, if you don't lose it, you lose it. If you don't use it, you lose. It is so true when it comes to these types of things you have to practice and practice to get to that level of muscle memory. I think it be super interesting to like dedicate an episode on how like police can be retrained to do it would be so amazing. And what would the, what would, yeah, what would that look like? I feel like, I feel like your, your connection between like what we had to abide by and what we were taught, you know, just kind of seeing like where that might be able to be inserted and like what already overlaps as like an easy Avenue of initiation. I think, I think that would be, I think that would be super interesting to explore and possibly be like a platform that right. That'd be a program. Absolutely. That's going to be a program and I'd be more than happy to volunteer my time.
Speaker 1 (40:57):
Yeah, definitely. I think we should look into this because I was looking up a few things online and it looks like I'm like, I don't know, I I'll have to look into this cause like specific to like the Bart police, they, they now have a continued professional training program. I don't know if that was as a result of what happened in Fruitvale. I have to look into that, but it looks like they have a actual program to continue professional training. But the thing is that the thing is, what I've learned is that, you know, we can, we can give more training. Right. But we need to also do they need to do a lot more simulations and training to bookwork? Not just reading, not just sitting in a class for 45 minutes, no more application than taking tests.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Do they what's that what'd you say?
Speaker 1 (41:45):
I don't know. I'd have to research that. I think that's something really good that we should dig into to see like what they currently have in place to kind of be informed about it.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
You guys, you guys want to have like a JRTC for cops. Totally doable. I totally think they should. They, they, it would be great to actually conduct more stressful environment, you know, training and retraining and make it, you know, whether that's a quarterly basis and so on. Definitely in a sense, we do want to demilitarize, you know, police leave military shit to the military police officers. You are not, you are not soldiers. You're peace officers. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
Because a lot of them are vets don't they
Speaker 2 (42:33):
On uniform? No, that's great that we have veterans within these communities. We do need veterans in these communities. Okay. We really do. But most importantly, I think we can, again, seek that change by being the change of providing a solution. I'd be more than happy to actually let's us form what this looks like. Let's put together a proposal, push, push it forward. I have so many amazing people that teach all over the world, you know, teach other militaries, other police entities and like all around the world. Like why can't we do it in our own country, right? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. If anything, this is a great business opportunity, you know?
Speaker 1 (43:18):
Yeah. Like I'm already brought up JRTC, which is really good. A lot of you guys don't know. I actually did JRTC in high school air force JRTC ever be an air force unit uniform. But I, what I love about JRTC is it's not just training you in one area, right? It's teaching you leadership, it's teaching you character, it's teaching you community service. Like I think a lot of, I think what our officers need to know a lot more about is community like service, because, and really understand what serve and protect really means being in the community as someone where you see them and you're not afraid of them, you see them. And you're like, Oh, cause like, you know, you should be able to see a cop and, and like go up and talk to them without being afraid. And I think that's so sad.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
And like, when we were talking about perception, we were even talking about deescalation and how standing certain ways are intimidating. Looking like you're all full on full metal jacket is also very intimidating. And I was here. I told you guys before, like one time we were going to, it was like a toys for tots donation outside of like a target or something. And the cops were out there and they were doing a really good thing. However, when I walked up to the car, I was just like, Whoa, there was like an M 16 in the door. There was like a Kevlar on the sea. There was, the dude had like a big like flag, bad sign. It looks scary. It looks scary. And if you have trauma with the police already, you're, it's already in your subconscious to be afraid. So I think, and you know what, maybe, you know, we shouldn't be in this probably sounds really crazy, but I understand like a lot of cops lives are in danger out there.
Speaker 1 (45:03):
So a lot of them are we're in this stuff to actually protect themselves from what's going on. I think we also need to bring back, you know, putting cops in communities that they're familiar with. That's another thing that, that I always wondered about like, yeah, why are we inserting cops that have never been exposed to like a certain demographics of people in there to like maintain their safety when they already have a lot of them, not all of them, but some of them have these unconscious biases that they had already in place growing up or whatever traumas that they already had and their ideas that they already had. And then we asked them to be their best self in this community when some of their reactions are literally just unconscious reactions. So maybe some of the training needs to really include like unconscious bias as well, from their perspective. That might be something that can be built.
Speaker 3 (45:53):
I think anyone who doesn't know for everyone who doesn't know what JRTC is, it's a field exercise training, which is basically like a month long simulation of the battle area, the area of operation that we're going to be deployed to. So your unit, which is like the group that you deploy with goes through a month long field exercise stands for joint readiness training center. Exactly. And there's two sides of it. There are actual soldiers that have embodied the locals and the quote unquote emanate enemy forces that we are going over there to both protect, serve, and fight against. So I think that isn't where, where we're talking about like empathy and unconscious training is when we put these cops in a simulation that say, you have to, you have to, you have to go and formulate a protest based on these key factors and put them through like a simulation. And the other side has to, it's like, it's like red team, blue team, the others, it has to have, you know, it has to meet all of these requirements of right. Maintain the escalating protest. What?
Speaker 1 (47:14):
Yeah, I got confused. I heard jr. T J R O T. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is definitely, they, RTC was fun to me. It's both,
Speaker 2 (47:30):
Both are extremely relevant at the moment. I think the JRTC perspective, I totally agree with that. And for those who don't understand, like how could this be effective? There's science behind it? So when you isolate someone or in this case, like an entire team, an entire brigade, it could be tens of people could be hundreds, it could be thousands, right? And you're in a simulator, it becomes reality right. Day in, day out. And you're under a lot of duress stress and you're meeting all these operational needs. You're building, you're destroying your coming together. There's a whole list of things that so like over a period of time, it does become reality. Even when you doubt it. And you're like, hi, this is going to end. No, that's not how it typically works. There were a lot of like psychological effects that are put in place. And that's why it's isolated. And typically, you know, this is conducted in a joint task force. There are other services involved sometimes even, you know, like it could be like a few local police or something like that. What's, what's important about this is it's a similar simulation, but you act as if it is the it right. We fight as we train and we train as we fight. So there shouldn't be different. So like if, if the police force is trained to automatically shoot right, then that's what they're going to do in the field.
Speaker 1 (48:56):
So many deescalation devices on them, like there's so many
Speaker 2 (49:02):
[Inaudible]
Speaker 1 (49:03):
I just always had question. I was just like, why straight for the gun? And that's, that comes from the training aspect. Right. And that would definitely having something like that, where there, they have a simulation where they have all these different kind of light and they take it, take it from real case studies of stuff that's happened and create that and take them through it over and over so that they're automatically not pulling out a gun. You know what I mean? There's you have pepper spray tasers. There's there's you can talk to people. There's so many ways where I'm just like, why are, why is it for like some just want to instantly go to, you know, shooting and, and, and possibly maiming someone. Also, I think some other things about that that are included with that too, that need to be handled with, even with the simulation is just getting under there's unconscious bias.
Speaker 1 (49:50):
So if you had an unconscious fear based on, you know, of a specific demographic of people too, like that could also influence how you react to just like, think there are certain, Oh my God, this is so crazy. I've seen like certain situations where it's like, we're like someone's dog. Or they're like, Oh my God, this person's dog. Doesn't like black people. And I'm like, dog doesn't know anything about black people. Right. But maybe the owner like train them too. And it wasn't went in their subconscious that, Oh my God, it's a black person. Danger black person danger. Right. So just like thinking that, because we don't know some of these people's childhoods, right? Like some of these cops, like, like I was saying, like last week to you guys, some of these cops, like they're there, they came from the Jim Crow era.
Speaker 1 (50:42):
This is a legacy that they are following along. Right. They might not even want it to be a cop. So that's why, that's why empathy is so important when you're trying to understand people that maybe disagree or they're on the opposite side or whatever, you know, they could have grown up. Like it was literally drilled into them to be this cop. Dad was a cop and these were all dad's experiences. And they were kind of in that environment where they didn't feel like they could speak up. And so now they are taking that out on the job at, you know, with what they're doing subconsciously I won't. So I wanted to mention that these training, like these field training simulations are evaluated as well. So it will identify these tendencies and hopefully catch them and correct them on the spot in the simulation. So it's very neat. It's I think it's honestly a really powerful thing that we're onto right now.
Speaker 2 (51:38):
I, I absolutely, I've always thought about this and I was like, we can actually support this. The time is now, like, there's no need for us to kind of like dwell on this. Let's regroup and let, let's keep the conversation going for our listeners. Please. Do you have any opinions on this? Like, we're happy to hear. We're happy to indulge on your opinions and knowledge to kind of like start wrapping it up. I think that there are so many tools that we can dig up and dig into to figure out ways to implement reform. Right. That goes, it's a three 60 approach, right? Policy is one angle training. The force is another angle. And then we can come up with other ways, right. Whether from community perspective as well, right? Like it's, it's, it's a multiset sided issue and it involves more than just two audiences. You know, it's not just the police victims, right? Like there's like, you know,
Speaker 1 (52:34):
Think against the police. There's so many good police officers out there. Absolutely. So many out there risking their lives for us every day. So it's never one
Speaker 2 (52:43):
Taken away from that at all. If anything, we're, we are definitely honing in and addressing racist beliefs or the lack of training in the training. And so none of, none of what's happened, you know, especially to our victims. May they rest in peace? None of what's ha what happened is justifiable in any means, lack of training are not, it is not justified. I want to be clear on that. That is unacceptable. It is. I think I've seen all over the media, like how officials are saying, you know, I'm pretty sure, you know, like George Floyd is happy right now to look down and see like what's happening. He's gone. He's gone.
Speaker 2 (53:33):
Yeah. That's yes. I mean, his daughter's going to grow up without a father, like nodding people, empathy, thinking about it, being in someone else's shoes. I think that's why it's so important. When even before you start taking action, if you don't have the capacity to empathize, I don't think you're ready for that step. You shouldn't be facing forward. You should not be like a speaker. You should not be an official. You should not be a president. You should not be a politician. If you do not possess the ability and capability of empathy, move out of the way people stepping presidential chair, TCL. Oh my gosh. You know what? We're going to leave that for another episode. But with this being said, we're parking so many conversations and we hope to hear from you, our audience, absolutely comments guide action. You did not another hashtag, right? You just watched like a live transpiring of putting our skills together to make an impact. We did not have this plant. Not at all.
Speaker 2 (54:44):
Yes, absolutely. Like I just want to reiterate then what we say and what we've been saying, you know, it's important. Don't take our word for it to your own research, right? It says, this is our opinions. These are our thoughts. And these are our views, but do your own research and definitely follow up. This should not ever just be another hashtag. We need to really take action for longterm change. And it all starts with you on the inside. So just want to like leave you with that note. Please leave any like questions or any like responses or feedback below. Like I said, we're all very open people and, and open to learning more and educate us. Like if you, if you know more about something that put it in the comments below, like we want to learn, we aren't perfect. I want to say, thank you so much for joining us for our fourth episode. This is so amazing that we're able to do this for you. I want to thank my cohosts. You guys are amazing. And I love hearing your points of view. Also want to thank all of the people that make it possible for us to create this program as well. So please follow us on social media. We are a K thanks podcast on all platforms. And then our website is www dot Kate. Next podcast.com. Check us out tune in next time.
Speaker 4 (56:12):
[Inaudible].